A.V. Club Chicago slams Corgan over Facebook “assault threats” 10:27 pm // Thursday, August 25, 2011
Posted by jjb in billy corgan, criticism, news.trackback
The infotainment website formerly known as Decider Chicago has waded into a bitter dispute between Smashing Pumpkins frontman Billy Corgan and an Oregon equipment manufacturer.
Following up on three angry tweets made last night (and later deleted) by Corgan, A.V. Club Chicago’s Anna Gross today posted excerpts from Facebook messages “reportedly” sent from Corgan to Devi Ever, 31, of Portland-based firm Effector 13. Gross said that the messages contain “assault threats” and that Corgan’s tweets in reference to Ever showed disrespect toward transgender people.
In 2008, Corgan was accused in Rolling Stone of having resorted to “juvenile homophobia” while arguing with a fan from the stage at a New York concert. Last month, Marah Eakin of A.V. Club Chicago wrote that she hopes Corgan’s new pro wrestling venture “involves [Corgan] getting hit with a lot of chairs.”
This ‘person’ needs help. Got a tip if you’re reading this. If you don’t like Billy Corgan, The Smashing Pumpkins, or Zwan. Move on… Stop f’n listening. Listen to your Radiohead records and be happy.
In the words of Artie. “WWWWWWAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH’
What do you mean ‘person’, Jason South? Are you transgendered hater like Billy Corgan?
It must be tough to see your bald god for the fucking asshole that he is.
The entire situation is messy. Lesson is don’t complain about your clients online and clients don’t ‘feed the trolls’ back.
Also, IF Billy did send those messages via Facebook – have screenshots been posted online? We all saw the tweets, but at the moment we are taking their word that they received that from Billy.
I think this is all mischaracterization of an angrey Billy. Why can’t we just believe he’s mad over the pedals and Devi’s comments about LDS followers? And where are the fb screenshots?
Billy Corgan is a dick! He’s reckless, arrogant, stupid dick. And Netphorians are pussies. And this chick is an asshole. Pussies don’t like dicks, because pussies get fucked by dicks. But dicks also fuck assholes: assholes that just want to shit on everything. Pussies may think they can deal with assholes their way. But the only thing that can fuck an asshole is a dick, with some balls. The problem with dicks is: they fuck too much or fuck when it isn’t appropriate – and it takes a pussy to show them that. But sometimes, pussies can be so full of shit that they become assholes themselves… because pussies are an inch and half away from ass holes. I don’t know much about this crazy, crazy world, but I do know this: If you don’t let us fuck this asshole, we’re going to have our dicks and pussies all covered in shit!
Anyways… Didn’t mean to offend, just hope she moves on. BC is a dick for saying what he did.
How is what he said to this Devi person an attack on transstupid people? What the fuck are you supposed to call it? I’ll stick with transstupid. Go ahead and flame all you want. This is a free country and I’ll say what I want to. People have said some horrible shit about the pumpkins since netphoria started but some fucking idiot gets insulted by Billy and now there’s all this? Fuck that asshole! If she didn’t want to get burned by Billy she should have kept her mouth shut!
Yeah, Billy lashed out in the dumbest way possible but here’s some food for thought
-He’s recording a come back album he’s put a lot of his eggs in
-He’s trying to get the band ready to tour
-He’s trying to get a new indie wrestling promotion off the ground
-He’s been wading through the re-issue process he’s been promising for years and probably is pushing himself to make everyone happy
He’s piled a ton of fucking work on himself. We have a pretty good idea what his work ethic is like. So here he is juggling all these things at once, going over and approving all the different aspects of these projects. Doesn’t have time to think about the Silver Rose, let alone giving feedback. Knowing how he sleeps (we’ve seen If All Goes Wrong I can only imagine what’s it’s like when he’s so engaged) he might get 3 or 4 hours a day of sleep in the last week or two as it is. He winds up reading a Netphoria post filled with BS slung at him and his bandmates he cares so much about. He cracks and retaliates with words that can definitely come back to haunt him.
If Billy hated transgender people or whatever, he would have never asked this devi to make the pedals in the first place
omfg. see what happens when billy doesn’t think before he types/posts? it breeds hateful ignorance. good lord.
and don’t give me this ‘well some of you fans are just as bad and terrible.’ a lot of those fans never threaten violence, ever. on top of that, these negative fans comments get read by about 20-30 other people, but when billy speaks.. it reaches thousands. and when he speaks, the choir sings..
i’d agree she jumped the gun with her comments, and what she said was not necessary as far as client relations are concerned, but what he did and said in retaliation is completely inexcusable and it really disturbs me that some people can not see it that way.
@Adam
She attacked his band. He seems to really care about them, I mean they seem like great people all 3 of them he probably feels very blessed to have them in his life after all the “betrayal” he’s felt to those he thought had his back in the past. He seems like a lonely guy who appreciates these talented and honest people being there for him. Look at how pissed he got when the Upper Darby Theater used the old band promo instead of the new one. Look at how he fights tooth and nail for people to see what he sees in them and accept the past for what it is. I have no doubt he cares very deeply for them like family, now how would you feel if Devi said that kind of shit to your little brother (who you believe in and are trying to nurture) on some internet message board that disparages everything you’re trying to do?? I think plenty of people would fly off the hand like that too, especially considering the pressure that’s already there. You’re gonna light their shit up PC terms be damned! The difference is (and I this where I think the bulk of the problem lies) is that Billy can’t just tweet this to his 100 odd followers like we would to our friends. No, the man has 100,000s of followers that expect way more out of him. The thing is, Billy was probably so mad he became blind, or simply overlooked this important difference. As far as his previous experience with transsexualism goes, it probably did play a role in the terms he used to react with, but when someone attacks someone else who is close to you and whom you care about so much many people would just say “FUCK Political Correctnessness she just got personal”. Devi not seeing the band in the way Billy sees that becomes shocked at his response when in reality she was shitting on his family.
steaming pile of donkey crap. my bet is that those supposed threatening “emails” written by corgan were actually written by devi ever. there’s no grounds for any legal action, the whole thing is just one big fabrication drama. i don’t understand how saying “him/her” is deprecating. what is the proper way of saying that?
you call the person the sex they prefer to be referred as, what is so hard to understand about that?
and bountiful, do you think you’re explaining something to me i don’t understand? didn’t i already kind of say that? I said that his response was inexcusable. especially as a 40 something year old man who goes on and on about spirituality and seeking love over hate and so on, then he responds this way? If he wants to stop negativity towards him in it’s tracks, he needs to rise above it and embrace it with a positive attitude.. that’s one of the fundamental rules of embracing a spiritual path.
His/Her name is Devi. That’s not really a ‘Mary’ or a ‘John’ is it? I’ve never met anyone called Devi in my life. My first guess would have been that it is the name of someone foreign to me, perhaps an Indian or Swedish guy. How are we to know if Billy meant the ‘his/her’ comments to be about the person being transgender, or if he was merely covering both bases of the ‘Devi’ name. Her reasoning that he should have known that she was transgendered is flawed and she provides no evidence that he definately knew she was.
Seems like this could be a bit of a beat up to me, after watching her incoherant rant it is obvious she has an agenda to get the issue of ‘transphobia’ into the media.
This is horrible. I can’t believe he said these things. Yes, her post was pretty spiteful and yes, he’s probably under a lot of pressure right now. But still, I’d expect a different level of maturity from someone his age and in his position. He should apologise (of course he won’t).
@redeyeofthesea:
the proper way: saying “her” instead of “him/her”. Saying “him/her” shows a lack of respect for her choice to change her sex, it is in fact ridiculing it. To attack someone on the basis of one’s skin colour, religion, sex, nationality, etc. is never ok.
So, now you know. Try a little empathy sometime.
Billy is a human. He’s allowed to make mistakes and be angry sometimes.
@Adam I was trying to give some more perspective, which you seem to get. I do highly agree about practicing what you preach, and yes that would make him a hypocrite, but that argument aside I’m trying to rationally explain what would push a not-always-so-rational man to act out in such a harsh manner.
it’s whatever. you want drama you’ll create it for yourself.
I never thought the term “he/she” came close to being discriminatory until this person got offended by it. It seems like the perfect combination, being honest yet respectful. “He” represents the biological truth of the matter, and “she” represents the gender the person identifies as. “She” alone would be wildly inaccurate, and “he” alone would not acknowledge their choice.
Actually, I’m not sure what the person in question started out as, so it could be the other way around.
I had no idea Devi was transgendered. If you’ve never actually MET her, you’d not know what sort of gender the name Devi corresponded to. The one person I know that went by that was named Devon. Could have been a simple matter of ignorance.
Devi’s been bitching for a while about not getting enough attention from Billy. It’s kind of a matter of entitlement, and I think they’ve been feuding a while. I also have seen her be pretty ugly about other things in the past (not regarding BC). This whole thing is messy and I’m keeping my nose out of it.
Whoa, lot of nonsense! Only way to be disrespectful of Devi would have been calling her an “him”, not both ways. She’s trying to get attention after what it clearly stands as a failure (the “pedal affaire”). So far, she’s been succesfull at it.
Pretending Corgan shouldn’t shout out at people who’s just trying to attach their name to his for the sake of some advertisement is really hypocrite.
For what whe know Corgan commissioned a pedal to Devi, make some tweet about months ago, literally promoting her business. Then, silence fell. Now we know Corgan received the pedal and was totally disappointed, and he never lamented in public, until Devi came out with that post on Netphoria. I’m calling Corgan a gentleman here, but “fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice…”.
I think you hit the nail on the head, zzav. Corgan kind of panned the Rocket, but never outwardly slandered or insulted Devi’s work. It wasn’t until she lashed out that the retaliation came. Since she instigated, I don’t doubt her falsifying some things.
That said, while we’re being honest, any pedals I’ve tried from her are gimmicky and pretty shoddy at best. I don’t see the appeal when you can save a bit more and get pedals with more flexibility.
This whole thing is utterly pathetic and shows how profoundly dysfunctional and flawed Billy Corgan is as a person. He’s 44 for fuck’s sake and literally behaving like a 10 year old; and not a very bright one at that – It’s funny because he loses the ability to articulate himself when he gets angry and flustered! He’s tired and he’s working on an album, a tour, a book, a wrestling company – SO FUCKING WHAT! Those things are all his choice, he’s not exactly a brain surgeon fighting to save people’s lives!
Also, this behaviour hardly lends credibility to anything he’s talked about in the past with regards to his own mistreatment and abuse. Having said that, whilst he was singing about love and monogamy, I have have it on good authority that he was fucking around and when he was claiming to be clean, he was taking shit-loads of drugs. Basically he’s full of shit. As are most people who profess to be spiritually happy – which is really just a way to deflect any real-life issues with empty, platitudinous nonsense.
It’s a shame because I used to respect him as a wordly,deep thinking, bright artist. Now I just think he’s a fucking dick who has completely lost perspective.
Devi seems to be a bit fucked up too!
How the fuck are these people successful when they are so pathetic?!
@The Stoic, I don’t profess to know what Corgan is thinking or where he is w/r/t recovery or personal spirituality or anything, but the literature on Adult Children of Alcoholics does suggest that many folks who grew up in shitty, chaotic situations often try to “act normal” and say the right things because they don’t know what normal is and tend to respond to disappointment/betrayal in totally unhinged ways. I’m not saying this is Corgan’s deal, but this kind of behavior doesn’t necessarily undermine a person’s own account of his/her abuse. Abuse victims often become abusers, etc.
That said, given the details of this that have come out, Billy and Devi both could have been nicer to each other or, at the very least, kept their personal beefs a bit more personal. Public apologies all around, I say. Hugs and kisses and make up rock.
So Oceania could be pretty good, yeah?
hahaha Cain. Got the right idea! Looking forward to the music!
this is awesome
moronic internet comments are significantly more entertaining than any reality show
@sad Navigator – Good points made there but he is 44 and a millionaire! At some point, you gotta start taking care of shit and drop the victim tag.
@The Stoic, yeah. If true, it’s not cool to threaten folks with violence. It’s not necessarily how I’d like to imagine myself behaving if I were in Corgan’s situation myself. Of course, sometimes folks get drunk or worked up or whatever and act like big-time jerks. If it were me involved in this situation (on either side), I’d prolly be working to apologize and mend fences. I can understand why folks on either side would be hurt/angry. But as an observer and fan of both people’s work, I just find the whole thing disappointing.
If I chopped my penis off, I would definitely keep it – like in a jar or something.
B0LLY C0RG0N IS A DESTRUCTIVE HUMAN BEING.
Devi has gotten the attention she so sorely crawes, too bad that its the 15 minute duration kind. It does raise the question, would you be cheering with billy if devi wasnt trans?
I think so. Putting her up on a pedestal does seem counter productive to the acceptance of trans people in society, Its almost like saying “it´s alright to get cross with this group but not this one”.
She has also been really commiting business harakiri with this one, posting on reddit, forums and wherever she can personal messages between her and Billy.
the AV article isn’t very acurate as to what went down.
Devi started this crap. she posted a long rant slamming billy for not using her pedals on the new album, which is what his tweet was a reaction to. She was unprofessional and the rant was obsurd. His choice of words was also over the top.
His PM on facebook was another reaction to her rants online. Setting aside the “he/she” comments, I don’t see where he was all that out of line. She threatened to sue him! She’s posting this shit all over the internet.
If billy had sent her a PM or Tweeted this without provacation I’d have been appalled. But she’s no victim here. She created this altercation will Billy and now acts like a victim?
Not cool.
“Devi” clearly has some personal problems to work on, plus I believe Corgan was constantly contacted to draw him into trying a pedal/s. I’d venture he probably could have and should have found far better products to sample.
robbo i hope you’re trolling. either way not funny.
anyhoot.. i just caught some inside word that Billy actually used Devi’s Silver Rose pedal all over Oceania, but is so pissed off with this situation now that he is considering erasing all said guitar tracks and redubbing them, and he will ont be able to do half of that until after the scheduled tours. If this is the case, Oceania could be delayed another two months.
like shit. just get over it dude!
@baroon, I don’t know if yr a fuzz guitar nut or not, but Devi’s original stuff is pretty good. I can see why Corgan might see them as not quite right for a big, controlled live setting — they can be a bit unpredictable/wild/skronky. They’re splatty and aggressive and certainly not an EVERYWHERE ALL THE TIME kind of fuzz if you’re doing what is basically pop type music.
And it’s not like everything that Devi does is wonderful or that non-famous guitar nerd people don’t have strong opinions about her stuff. And she does have a reputation (I’ve not witnessed it, but I’ve heard stories) amongst internet guitar weirdos for going thermonuclear in the face of criticism. But I also have witnessed internet guitar dudes (and it’s a very dudely culture) be totally nasty w/r/t her gender.
anyone know how i could sew a pair of pants out of pancakes?
he might sound like a dick but no more than anyone else in the planet. i myself dont have a facebook but i hear all the bickering that goes on with my friends, or tweets between celebs, he is no different, she attacked first he got mad, bottome line she shouldnt bash clients online he should rise above it they both acted like kids fighting via the intenet and publicly now move on not a big deal
@mipples — YOU’D NEED THREAD MADE OUT OF BACON!
so much negativity in this world .. we all will burn in hell
i got pockets full of maple syrup
Now I want pancakes. Or waffles. Or maybe some fuckin’ french toast.
dajo pajo just tweeted this article.
@Adam…he wants pancakes too?
Our breakfastses are gonna burn when we’re all in Hell… :-/
“you call the person the sex they prefer to be referred as, what is so hard to understand about that?”
Because it’s wrong. This person mutilated his genitals and is taking chemicals to alter his body. Until his DNA says female, he’s a he. A very sick (and ugly) one, too.
@truth hurts
Sex and gender are not the same thing. Grow up.
@truth hurts, read up a bit and get the whole “biological sex” vs. “gender performance” thing sorted for yourself.
maybe this drama will inject some needed emotion into the oceania recordings….
http://www.thinkbabynames.com/meaning/0/Devi just had to post that…because i actually know someone called devi .
just for you all :)
“Sex and gender are not the same thing.”
Exactly. The perverts are using the word “gender” for “sex” to justify their gross actions.
“@truth hurts, read up a bit and get the whole “biological sex” vs. “gender performance” thing sorted for yourself.”
Nonsense.
So, what did Devi post on Netphoria? Don’t feel like visiting virus-land.
Wow this situation was blown out of hand before but now this is just getting exaggerated.
I am not going to assume that because Billy is friends with Monte that means he’s homophobic. (nor do I assume that about Monte despite people labeling his relegion for who HE is) I am a gay activist for San Francisco and I honestly saw this whole situation as provoking then bullying more than anything else.
I am disappointed how Billy responded, but Devi can’t act like the helpless victim either, she really did provoke some stuff and was considered a friend of Billy’s. If Billy’s life was not connecting with her’s (according to what she said in her youtube vent)then she should have just moved on and not said anything, but she DID attack the band and Billy with some really messed up stuff. I really like Devi for her activism especially in the music scene, however I don’t like that she is using being transgender as a shield for Billy’s attacks. It was wrong for him to do BUT they were both making very personal attacks on eachother, not general, but personal attacks.
Billy reacting was very disappointing, especially since I am from the younger generation of Pumpkins fans, and though he should have the right to be upset, the way he lashed out at Devi was unprofessional to say the least.
I’ve mentioned this a few times before but I really hope this whole mess just breezes over and does not cloud any of Billy’s choices.
@Adam, according to Devi herself, Billy never used SilverRose on Oceania, and judging how Billy posted a tweet today that he’s working on the title track, that seems to be the case.
Billy was provoked and mad. He is a person. All people get mad. His comments towards Devi aim to insult her as a person, not as a trandgender woman, and there isn’t anything to suggest that he hates transgender people.
Think he’s a jerk for blowing up at Devi or don’t. That’s your personal perspective and something you need to evaluate for yourself. But don’t mischaracterize him as a bigot. To me, that’s a sad attempt to knock down someone, who seems to generally be a very caring individual, just because it’s “hip” to dump on him.
Oh, Billy’s pathetic you say? What the fuck are you doing but bitching about someone else bitching? OMG Billy got MAD, but he’s not SUPPOSED to get mad and vent! Holy shit you guys take this shit so personally!
I think this a Don King style ramp-up to a female vs. “female” transgender cage match. Sunday. Sunday! SUNDAY!
I don’t care, I just want to hear the new music.
Thank you, thereitgoes and Misery. Truth!
I’d expect better from Corgan, but I’m not gonna shit my pants over it. It’s not as if he’s preaching a hatred for trangender folk, and as far as I can tell, he hasn’t been putting transphobic undertones in his music, so it’s not that big an issue.
WOT I TINK IS DAT DEY SULD JUST BE FRENS
I agree that the comments were over the line, but that’s what they were. Comments. What Billy said was offensive and meant to injure but it isn’t indicative of deep seated hatred. He blew up at comments that he likely found equally personal and injuring. “But he threatened personal violence!!!!!!1!1!” Shut up. Shut the fuck up. It was just empty blustering in typical internet-tough-guy fashion. Get over yourselves. (Oh and to the Netphorians, “He threatened violence against a woman!!!” You are chauvinist and sexist. Oh, and way to go bashing Billy for intolerance when you attack Monte’s religion and call him evil. Hypocrites.)
And opposite of making me feel sorry for her, Devi’s video put my uncommitted mind in Billy’s favor. “I’m intimidated! He might send hitmen after me!” Hahahah, please. Drama queen blowing things out of proportion all the way. And I wouldn’t put it past her she made up the emails. On a guitar pedal forum, when someone harbored reasonable doubt and asked her how we could know they were real, instead of explaining herself she just said “fuck off” and never answered. Quite telling, I think.
Can we talk about this at SP community meetings?
Billy is a baby. He even looks like a gynormous baby.
As a straight, white, male, I hereby give everyone the right to use me as a verbal punching-bag. It’s okay, re-directing insults to me is entirely PC.
Really, people? There are more comments on this stupid crap than on any other articles on the homepage. Is this what the fan base cares about most?
yes… ;-)
No, I care about pancakes and music..
The moral of the story is, the music still sucks.
The most important thing is that Pitchfork hasn’t written a news article about this yet. I seriously thought they would have jumped at the chance.
And you fuckers, now I want some motherfuckin’ pancakes.
“I don’t subscribe to the politics around AIDS”
Devi’s pedals suck ass. She’s named most of her pedals after pumpkin songs, and supposedly they are intended to sound like pumpkin tones (which they fail to do). She’s just a leech trying to make a buck off of billy and the pumpkin brand.
Billy is just a man. He’s allowed to lash out when someone talks shit on him or his “family”. Grow up people!
This is some bad energy before the coming times given their importance. Hope all works out for the new era given this inauspicious origin.
From Devi’s youtube: “Matter of fact, its funny, y’know, one of the reasons this resonates even more with me is because Billy Corgan is…a person who professes of God, who professes of love, but when it comes down to it, when the actual rubber meets the road, there’s nothing there.” Zero indeed.
huh well her pedals are good enough for thurston moore, nels cline, jeff tweedy, rhcp, my bloody valentine, etc etc etc. she’s made a killing off of her fuzzes. odd personality? sure, but i disagree with people who say her product sucks. i own one of her fuzzes and it’s a terrific little box.
made a killing? how do you know this? are you just full of shit as usual or are have you access to her bank account?
does she even make them though? seems the only thing she does is print the label on them and let others do the design and soldering.
If anybody doesn’t understand why she’s sensitive about implied transphobia, they could just look at these replies right here for a tiny sampling of mind-boggling, stomach-churning hate and ignorance about the topic, which is a topic that in this day and age there’s no reason to be ignorant of, and then imagine trying to deal with that bullshit every day from people so worthless and entitled that they think they should talk that way, and then wonder how sensitive about it you’d be.
Rick, you sound pretty “worthless and entitled” yourself. And for the record, I got nothing against trans people myself, but if I saw one I would say “he/she”. If that person asked me not to or told me they preferred another term, I’d use it instead. This “Devi” is making this issue into something about “transphobia” when it has nothing to do with that, just so she could get some attention. Al Sharpton does the same thing. How Billy saying “he/she” = Billy saying “I hate all transgender people” is beyond me. You are putting words into his mouth and so is Devi. If you really are for trans issues, this kind of behavior is deplorable and you should be ashamed of yourself and so should Devi.
I feel like I’m watching that movie Crash….
Her/him/it needs to get the fuck over itself. Call him/her/it the wahmbulance.
Both were dicks in this situation. Don’t blameo only Corgan, for fucks sake. And I’ve read on oboard, that that fb account may be not legit/fake.
Adam, from whom did you hear the thing about redubbing all guitar parts all over again?
Ok, I’m sorry, but I just couldn’t read through all the posts. Too many and it’s late.
Anyhoot, I feel both parties are at fault here. Devi should have known better than to publicly slight a client. It’s highly unprofessional. I understand her frustration from not only a transgender person, but a fan’s point of view, but once you’ve been “commissioned” in a business relationship, it’s not in your best interest to publicly vent your frustrations.
That said, Billy takes the cake here, folks.
He used the “he/she” because he was unsure of what to use? Bullshit. This is someone he’s had business contact with. He knows damn well which pronoun to use, because he’s already used it in correspondence we haven’t seen. Using “he/she” was meant to be an insult, no bones about it.
Billy having this view is interesting on many levels. First of all, as a victim of abuse, it is unsettling that he’d threaten violence on a woman, regardless of whether that particular woman was born a man or not.
Furthermore, I’m sure Billy has worn more dresses in his lifetime than Devi. I’m half-joking, but for someone who is supposedly all about challenging gender norms, these comments are disturbing.
Also, from a logistical standpoint, Billy wanting Devi to create a pedal that emulates other pedals and then bashing her for a lack of creativity is….well, stupid. He received what he asked for.
Finally, these comments must not be taken in a vacuum. I understand some of you want to defend Billy, but come on. He’s been on a MASSIVE downward spiral since 2008. I’m not living in the past (side note: this accusation is bullshit. Just because Billy has clearly declined doesn’t mean that his critics are “living in the past.” Honestly, how many of you are here because of the undeniable power of anything Corgan has produced since 2000?). I was 9 when Siamese Dream came out. I was on board for Zeitgeist. But between berating fans on the 20th anniversary tour, kicking Jimmy out, getting in troll fights with fans on facebook, the wrestling bullshit, and the lackluster music (although I do generally like EP2 of TBK), he is clearly someone whose actions are incompatible with his supposedly “centered’ spiritual stance. I just hope he takes an ounce of this piss and vinegar to his music. Maybe he’ll then be relevant again.
@stratoholic–yeah, bro, “Noise Floor” and “Hyperion” are killer Pumpkins classics.
@Adam is 100% right. Lots of people like Devi’s fuzzes. She’s a pretty big name as far as boutique pedals go. I’ve got one and it’s great–wild and useful at the same time. Neat sounds.
Devi does design her own fuzz circuits and made/makes a lot of that shit by hand. Plus she’s very open about helping folks DIY pedals using her circuits, and she keeps her prices reasonable (not true of a lot of boutique builders). She’s certainly prone to mixing it up on the Internet, but she’s and interesting woman who makes cool fuzzes. No need for some–who prolly didn’t know her name until this story–to tear her down completely just because she and Billy decided to be nasty to eachother.
@Adam
so the info you got is true? who do you know from SP recording camp?
listen to first 10 seconds
‘Hiiii. Am I a man? Am I a woman? Probably both’
So why she is offended be she/he.
Also, that attacking of beating may be fake.
I’m not defending Billy, but I hate Devi for posting this story all over the internet, pretending to be victim, when she did a lot more than Billy. He tweeted 3 times I think, and she was angry cuz he decided not to use the pedals? Maybe he did use them. And she shitted on him all these post-reformation years, recently calling him dead and fuck new SP. I don’t know, I usually try not to be on Billys side, when I see that he is wrong, but now I’m with him. He is a human being, with emotions, He tweeted in anger. You say that 40 year old should control himself? Some can, some not. It depends of situation.
by* she/he
If someone would bring shit on me and my friends I would defend me and them, no matter how stupid may I look to others around.
the first few seconds of that video speak volumes here. her use of the man/woman thing is acceptable, but Billy using it is transphobic? so what, is she taking ownership of the ‘he/she’ phrasing so it takes power away from when the transphobic people use that sort of language, a la when ethnicities do the same w racial terminologies? if so, a.) that’s ridiculously stupid and counterproductive, and b.) then it shouldn’t bother her when others use that phrasing as she’s already stripped it of it’s power and that person’s desired effect. and if she was just joking in this video, which is probably the case, then she should watch the types of things she finds funny one day, and offended by the next.
oh, and i’m getting a Silver Rose.
and i can’t wait for ‘Oceania’.
@Hafstein, just google her name or you tube it, and you’ll see she’s being supported by a lot of major names, her pedals are being sold through major retailers, etc etc.
Here’s a video of Nels Cline giving one of her fuzzes some good praise, and this was in his art of the stompbox dvd.
I’ve seen it on the pedal board of numerous acts, both major and minor. I play one of them, and at every gig i get compliments on the tone, and when asked what the pedal is, the name is instantly recognized with a ‘oh yeah, her pedals are incredible!’ etc etc. She’s sitting on a $250,000 dollar a year business, and over the past couple years she’s had to hire more help, move to bigger offices, etc etc. so like sad navigator said, do some research before talking out of your own ass, she’s doing very well for herself. I mean, Billy looked to her for the perfect fuzz in the first place, right? People like Billy Corgan don’t just go to average joe pedal makers.. it’s just too bad they had a falling out.
oh yeah and here’s the farkin video:
if you don’t know who nels cline is, i’m sorry.
Dunno about her pedals, but the dude from A Place To Bury Strangers makes really awesome custom pedals. So that’s fun.
And hey guys, I might be showing my ignorance here, as I don’t personally know any transgendered folks out in the big outside, but I use he/she and the variations of, because I’m never sure if they are male -> female or vice versa. The goal is to refer to them by whatever they are working into, but until I know that for certain, I see nothing wrong with he/she. That was the biggest news to me. I didn’t know that was offensive! At least it has a gender reference! I would understand the offense if Billy referred to her as “it”.
So hey, I learned something new through this.
I didn’t sense any transphobia (which is an AWESOME word), just cantankerous Billy showing that the reason he can write lyrics that 15-year-olds can relate to is because he still is in fact, a 15-year-old boy deep down. That is a terrible sentence. My apologies to all I have offended with it.
@colquibrett
I dont know if I would say fifteen, but he definitely acts a lot younger than his age. But I don’t see that as necessarily a bad thing. For a musician I think that’s important.
Adam
you ignored my questions or what?
anybody remember the days when rock musicians/ rock music was about rebellion and not giving a shit about being politically correct? so billy upset some people with his remarks, big deal.
@Graves No, because I assume most of us weren’t in the Sex Pistols
@misery You think the last band to do anything to offend people was the Sex Pistols? Where have you been?
“So, does this mean I’m not really a dolphin?” -Kyle’s dad
@Graves
I’ve been living in a generation where the cutting-edge of political-dissent is American Idiot. Why, where have you been?
@rappapapa yeah I was trolling expecting everyone to go into a shit fit. unfortunately for my little prank you were the only one that bit.
@Graves — remember when rock and roll rebellion at least pretended it was targeting “The Man” and other sources of institutionalized socio-cultural power vs. serving as an excuse for comfy middle class dudes to justify engaging in nasty retrograde anti-PC “shock” behavior?
@Adam
damn. oh well.. but I wouldn’t be surprised if you’re right though :D
@sadnavigator I see, so as far a s rock goes, offending the “man” is good, but offending someone like you is bad.
@Graves — What do you mean “someone like me?” I am “The Man.” Middle class. White. Heterosexual. College educated. Able-bodied. Professional. Over 30. I’m pretty privileged. And, yeah, I think “speaking truth to power” or at least “rattling power’s gilded cage” is a more enjoyable form of rebellion than “Tellin’ it like it is and sticking it to those PC people who want respect and shit.” *fistbumpfartretropornbeerpong*
And, in general, I find offensiveness in rock to be a pretty weaksauce application of the form. Rock’s days as a radical cultural force are long, long, long over. Now rock’s “shock” appeal is like that Onion article about Marilyn Manson going door-to-door to scare people.
This thread has 99 comments, but a bitch ain’t one.
HIT ME!
After watching Devi explain herself in her 18 minute video, I actually do feel feel sorry for her. He definitely crossed the line and she admits how intimidated she was of him but I hope he gives her a sincere apology and leaves it at that.
@ 100
There’s a joke related to this thread in there somewhere..
@thereitgoes
she admits? in which minute? She calls him nothing, plays a victim…
I think the video was taken down but she did say how intimidated she was of Billy’s response, even going so far to say, ‘he’s got millions, he could hire people to beat me up if he wanted to, lives in chicago, who knows, he could even have ties to the mob’. yeah she’s probably a bitch for saying what she said to a handful of people but for billy to say what he did to 100,000+ people is taking it far in my opinion. I understand he’s got a lot on his plate right now but I also understand the position that what he says sometimes doesn’t really match up to his spiritual values. I’m not judging him but I disagree with him on this issue and some others. What’s more important is what I take from the music, not really his beliefs in astrology, mysticism and so forth.
@theritgoes
Billy Corgan? Ties to the mob? You have got to be fucking kidding me….
mobstarz
I live in Columbus, OH, therefore I must have ties to moneyed, obsessive OSU Buckeyes football boosters who would stop at nothing to tip the scales in favor of their hometown team. I also come from an Italian family, and therefore have mob ties. The other side of my family has Irish roots, and therefore I have ties to IRA terrorists. Man, if I ever get angry at *anyone* they had better really be frightened…
“also understand the position that what he says sometimes doesn’t really match up to his spiritual values.”
What are his “spiritual values,” exactly? He wears a 666 shirt with the name of a devil on the back of it. I think that should tell you something.
You mean he wore a 666 shirt back in 1993. Not “wears”.
Was the sentiment abandoned then as well? Or was something big just beginning?
@t h w – It tells me he has a sense of humor.
Look under your bed. This guy is going to put a hit out on you.
http://www.last.fm/music/Billy+Corgan/+images/2582671
In all seriousness, I think this should be understood in the context of Billy Corgan being a man who was abused as a child. He’s done heroically well, considering. Let’s support his efforts to harmlessly bring music into the world.
sorry, but what a mood killer, lol
Yeah, sorry. Just keeping it real.
@thereitgoes: really? Where’s the humor in proclaiming allegiance with Lucifer? And even if it could possibly have been a joke (I think not), when you do it time and time again, over and over, it’s not really funny to anyone, is it?
@t w h — I think you might be missing some crucial alt-era irony related to “TEH METULZ” and it’s allegiance to “TEH DEBBIL.” Smirky Satanism is a favorite musician in-joke when bringing “TEH ROXXORZ.” I’ve hung with plenty of folks who’ve made hokey rock-related devil jokes. None of them actually had totally bitchin’ altars of human sacrifice in their rock dungeons.
Whoa to think that someone would even consider that B.C. is really proclaiming allegiance with Lucifer because of the said shirt is beyond my understanding and my beliefs.
@ is he one Remember when SP donated all the money from the Adore tour to charity. And more recently, that benefit show at the Metro last year. These action clearly point that Billy is working for lucifer.
Inexcusable. As an advocate of LGBT rights I find this to be appalling and insensitive language. What a horrible example to set. He had better issue an apology asap because this is not the kind of issue you play around with as an entertainer who makes their money off of patronage.
P.S. Can’t wait to read his “spiritual memoir.”
@Graves “Remember when SP donated all the money from the Adore tour to charity. And more recently, that benefit show at the Metro last year. These action clearly point that Billy is working for lucifer.”
Not sure if you’re being sarcastic or not, but donating to charities is actually a known practice of those who worship the white light of Lucifer.
As for BC. I like the guy. I think the 666 shirt was in poor taste and surely (for the spiritually minded) tempting with serious bad karma. The blasphemous Adore poster was worse, and from that alone I could see how @t w h would wonder. The more likely explanation is he’s a victim of a poor spiritual education so falls for New Age tripe including all the usual ecumenism and syncretism. Which many say is evil masked by a shallow innocence. Well I hope the spiritual memoir goes deeper than Blinking with Fists.
I regret even coming back to this thread but are you kidding me tone heaven? You don’t know that Graves was being sarcastic? Donating to charity is worshipping Lucifer? Let me guess, you were brought up in a highly religious environment who takes the bible at face value, no offense. If you don’t get the ironic undertones of SP, there’s no way you can understand what the pumpkins are about, which is fine I guess, interpret it as you want but don’t bring Lucifer into this, he’s rarely mentioned, if not at all with this band, in fact quite the opposite.
Gotta agree with @thereitgoes here. I was a bit shocked by “Tone heaven”‘s comment here. Whoa. There was SO nothing wrong with the 666 shirt. What is it, 1920 all over again!?
@tone heaven
Blasphemous Adore poster? Huh?
I think Billy Corgan has changed a lot. I doubt he was ever a satanic worshiper but up until the MACHINA/ ZWAN era I don’t think he was as strongly allied to God. So maybe the 666 shirt and this “blasphemous Adore poster” is just an aspect of Billy’s older taste.
There was a blasphemous Adore poster? lol wat?
@ziggy willis the back of ”Gish” tends to prove otherwise.
@Bring it!
Putting religious symbols on the back of an album cover is not exactly anywhere near the god-loving Billy Corgan has been doing publicly since the ZWAN era. You could argue that was for aesthetic purposes (as I occasionally use religious symbols or ideas in my own art but I am atheist). God, Jesus, or Mary the Virgin are not even in the thank you sections of the albums until then. Again I’m not saying he had no spirituality or belief until then, I’m just saying he didn’t feel as strongly about it, or at least didn’t speak so much about it then. Now, well, he’s literally writing a book about it.
I agree with both “Bring it!” and “Ziggy”. Billy stated recently that he was that into God and all since the beginning of the band…. this image(Gish) tends to prove him right in a way. But clearly he’s more out there now about that.
Yeah, def. the back cover of Gish. Oh, and “I AM ONE”. It’s not only God but specifically the God of Christianity that seems to have drawn him. It was part of the band’s mystique in the early days. I remember them in Chicago when they were still figuring out their sound and Billy wore a cross around his neck a lot. Maybe just for looks, who knows, but I think something was calling him. They were always a kind of mystical band. Long haired Billy really did have that feeling about him. The 666 thing was probably the first inkling of change? Yet….. I could be wrong but I thought “33″ was a super religious song. Nowadays with the “Hail Mary” and all that, and ZWAN, and the new songs, maybe he is getting back to it. But during the Adore/Machina era all this religious iconography was ditched for the opposite. Check http://nachtkabaret.com/SmashingPumpkins for more details than you prob wanna know.
P.s. I think that Adore thing is this. He was obviously not into Mary at the time. I don’t understand him at times and will have to wait for the book to really know, I guess.
http://www.offthewallposters.net/catalogue/index.php?main_page=popup_image&pID=11293
@brant
Wow…I guess that is a blasphemous of a poster as I can tell lol
Good find. :D