Corgan on Chamberlin: “Jimmy is a Destructive Human Being” 10:53 am // Thursday, March 4, 2010
Posted by chris in billy corgan, interview, jimmy chamberlin, magazines.trackback
One of the more-anticipated portions of Brian Hiatt’s sprawling profile of Billy Corgan in the latest issue of Rolling Stone was the promise of details regarding the surprising departure of Jimmy Chamberlin from the Smashing Pumpkins. Scant details were provided at the time, beyond the assertion from the Chamberlin camp that “there is no drama, bad blood, or anything else but a full committment to music,” leading many fans to believe that the parting was mostly amicable and that Jimmy was possibly no longer willing to devote the same time and energy into the Smashing Pumpkins that bandleader Billy Corgan was.
As time passed, it became clear that the former “musical soul mates” may not have parted on as good of terms as the two parties may have stated publicly, but no details have emerged until now. Hiatt portrays two very disparate accounts of the separation:
Billy:
Chamberlin is sober now, but Corgan is convinced that his character hasn’t changed, that he is fundamentally “unhealthy.” “Jimmy is a destructive human being, and people who are destructive break things,” Corgan says. “I don’t see me reaching the highest levels of my creativity if I’m unhealthy and if I have unhealthy people areound me.[...]” After Corgan told Chamberlin he was out, the drummer “unloaded” on Corgan, unleashing 20 years worth of pent-up insults. “So I was like, ‘Fuck you,’”, Corgan recalls. “‘Go ride around in a white van for the rest of your life.”
Jimmy:
Chamberlin becomes apoplectic when he hears Corgan’s account. “In the middle of the last tour, Billy said it was the agent’s fault, then it was the band’s fault, then it was the fans’ fault,” the drummer says. “Yes, in the past, I was a destructive human being. I was a complete drug addict and a complete loose cannon, but I’ve taken responsibility for my life.”
Those looking for a dispassionate, objective account of what occurred to so-quickly submarine a 20-year working relationship are sure to be disappointed, but those looking for a bit more context around the departure and the states of mind — at least as presented to an interviewer — of the principals will want to pick up a copy of the magazine.
“I don’t see myself reaching the highest levels of my creativity if i’m unhealthy and if i have unhealthy people around me”
LOLWUD?? Really billy? REALLY?? Maybe you’ve blocked out that part in the 90′s when you made the greatest albums of your career when everyone around you was a drug addict and/or refusing to work with you.
I guess i just misunderstood the severity of jimmy wandering off for weeks on drug binges and james and d’arcy refusing to work together because of their breakup in the siamese dream era. You see, i always thought those were unhealthy habits exhibited by unhealthy people around you but i guess they weren’t if you somehow reached one of your highest levels of creativity with them around.
I told Jason last night that I needed to take care of a lot of stuff at work before reading this article because I had a feeling it would upset me greatly. I’m pretty sure that this excerpt alone is doing enough upsetting, even without reading the full shebang.
What about redemption? What about respect for a working partner? What about the fundamental compromise that you have to make when you actually engage in a loving relationship with someone?
And then to so publicly throw a conniption fit about it…
*shakes head*
There’s nothing clearer to me in the article than by how much, for better and worse, Billy puts his work ahead of everything else…other people, yes, and himself too. Unheard work to him is a waste, which is why he’s so concerned with how it’s received and treated, which is why he wants to use the “SP” name…that and wanting/needing to go all-out all the time for the music being I think the sort of ‘underlying’, ‘functional’ reasons he split with Jimmy. All this “destructive human being” stuff to me is sort of an emotional rationalization, obviously an unattractive one.
Jimmy (in Hiatt’s words) “doesn’t see the point of spending months painstakingly recording music anymore,” and Jimmy says he “fucking hated the Nineties.” (Can anyone really have perspective on decades, independent of their own short lives? Jimmy’s only been through three of the things as an adult, for crying out loud.) Jimmy emphasizes his family here, not the ‘work drives everything else in life’ stuff he was saying at that drum clinic. All due peace to the man, and his choices appear more ‘normal’ or balanced than Billy’s, but at the same time I’m not going to take Billy’s music but then turn around and deny him personal respect as well. It would be one thing if I thought his music was no better than that of others who lead those ‘balanced’ lives, if I thought Billy’s sacrifices (even of bits of sanity) were completely pointless…but I won’t deny him the truth. I think his music is great, it lends a lot of beauty to my life (while the music of many other more ‘normal’ musicians hasn’t so much), and for me that counts a ton toward validating his life choices.
It kind of sounds like Jimmy just wanted to tour more instead of recording. But it’s not hard to imagine Billy responding to that, “Yeah, well, what music are we going to play? Oh yeah, that music I painstakingly recorded while you were a complete loose cannon. And in the Nineties, right?!” Jimmy may have wanted to be an adult now and an equal decision-making partner in the Pumpkins, but sometimes the past casts a relevant shadow. He owes his fortune and fame and possibly more to Billy, and maybe, in light of that, he should have continued to defer to the man. But, it’s academic now. :\
lol good job bro!
i really wanted to make a more meaningful response to your post jjb but i honestly can not do it without laughing out loud so pretend i made some weak arguments and said “LULZ FUX U CROGAN U BALD FGT” about five times and you were vindicated, ok?
Dudes, grow up!
You need each other.
We need you.
You can work it out!
hey, that makes me think of the beatles song “we can work it out” which then reminds me of all the songs the beatles made in their respective solo works to snipe at each other.
here’s hoping!!
DON’T get me wrong… I love Billy’s music. I think he is like a kung-fu master when he’s playing guitar. I even respect and understand some of his messages about spirituality.
But why why why must he burn bridges between SP members in this same way repeatedly? This makes me sad. ANOTHER killer musician and Pumpkin that will never make music as a Pumpkin again. :(
Great analysis, JJB! The fatalist in me (a small part), though, believes that Jimmy got his fame and fortune because he was supposed to get his fame and fortune. It’s debatable ad infinitum, I know. But if we look at your last more-or-less hypothetical (?): “He owes his fortune and fame and possibly more to Billy, and maybe, in light of that, he should have continued to defer to the man” – can we also say that the Smashing Pumpkins “name” possibly owes its notoriety to the Virgin Records marketing machine and the (ahem) zeitgeist of the ’90s? But no, the Virgin contract is long gone, and no one owes anyone anything (other than the unsettled lawsuits).
But sticking to your point, if the situation came down to perpetually deferring to Billy or Jimmy leaving, I guess the right choice was made (by whom? that’s debatable now). (As far as equal partners goes, we were led to believe that James and Billy were equal songwriting partners pre-D’arcy, but the relationship evolved otherwise.)
In any case, if Billy can exist in warpedperceptionland and make great music, that’s good. If Jimmy can exist in stablefamilyland and make great music, that’s good. If there is a This track called “Air Jordan Blues” with references to ‘Sammy Waterman’ and a Pumpkins track called “White Van Eternity,” then it should be an interesting new decade. :-)
If you are a person and all of your relationships fail( be it Philia or Eros)you need to look at what they all have in common. That would be you.
@jjb: Where do you get the impression that Jimmy wanted to tour rather than record in the studio? If anything, I would think that recording in a studio in Chicago would give him more time with his family than being on tour, but that’s assuming that Jimmy’s assertions about the importance of his family and the lesser importance of music are accurate.
EDIT: I can see from the quote you posted from the article that Jimmy may not have wanted the same studio experience that he’d had in the past, but I don’t see any references to touring.
@ pinkmnm ain’t that the truth.
i just don’t think jimmy wanted to be in the studio for months while billy and some hippies whittled their 2 inch obelisks all day
The dichotomy between Jimmy (in his clinics last year) wishing Billy all the best for the future and accepting that it’s cool to want the ‘success’ that Billy wants and Billy telling JC to ‘fuck off..white van…’ is startlingly sad.
Also, JJB JC should have deferred to Billy’s ideals? Why? Are you suggesting that Jimmy had absolutely nothing to do with the success [fame/fortune] of the band?
“I don’t see me reaching the highest levels of my creativity if I’m unhealthy and if I have unhealthy people around me.[...]”
If somebody you consider a kind of musical soulmate and with whom you spend the majority of the last 20 years making music together seems to be “unhealthy”, what do you do? You stay around, try to help wherever you can, try to be a good friend, right?
Well, I guess telling your friend to fuck off after 20 years is just part of Billy’s holistic concept of Body-Mind-Soul-Integration.
I’m sad.
The thing I can’t seem to wrap my head around is that Billy fired Jimmy presumably because of a lack of willingness to spend extended time in the studio working on new music, then hired a replacement drummer who he only requires to be in a studio for limited periods of time. I get that Jimmy had a bigger stature in the band than Mike Byrne does, and therefore Billy expected him to play more of a role in the process, but weren’t there ways that Billy could have made it clear that Jimmy was backing off and having less of a role in the band if he was intent on receiving the credit he deserved as the one putting in the time?
Oddly enough, I had an ex-girlfriend who also would talk about only surrounding herself with “healthy” people. Coincidentally, she was also involved in a cultlike group. Like jjb, I think this is mostly just post-hoc rationalization on Billy’s part and not really the reason that he fired Jimmy, but comments like that make Billy look really bad.
jimmy probably pulled the we’re-equal-partners-in-this-band card causing billy to have a shit fit and fire him off for standing in his way.
@Ryan D./Drevpile: It’s hard for me to think past the image of the band recording their breakthrough album. All Jimmy had to do/could do was sober up enough to lay down his tracks for Siamese Dream. It was (primarily) Billy who made everything happen – all the planning, ‘business’ arrangements, etc. – to where that was all Jimmy had to do. The point about the alt-rock wave, Virgin, etc., is sort of valid, but I think that given those things, Billy surely ‘makes it’ with or without Jimmy. (Do you really think Siamese Dream would have completely flopped if Butch Vig had drummed on five of the tracks and then they got another drummer for the subsequent tour? Virgin still markets the album, and “Disarm” would have sounded exactly the same.) A lot of alt-rock success stories came about without world’s-greatest-drummers in the lineups. Pearl Jam made it bigger than SP and they used about five different okay drummers…
@Chris, Billy looking ‘really bad’ is a gross understatement.
All this said, honestly, I don’t blame Jimmy a bit for wanting to call his own shots now that he’s over his adolescent drug addictions…but look, moving out of your dad’s basement doesn’t mean you get a 50% stake in the family business.
“LOLWUD?? Really billy? REALLY?? Maybe you’ve blocked out that part in the 90’s when you made the greatest albums of your career when everyone around you was a drug addict and/or refusing to work with you.”
This is only partly true. Once upon a time, Billy did have some good, genuine, “healthy” people in his life. Not perfect people, but people that honestly loved him – not the big rockstar he was becoming. By the time MCIS exploded, he had walked all over them, pissed all over them and tossed these nobodies out of his life. Billy traded them in for richer, prettier, more famous, more powerful, “better” models. When the sales took a nose dive, those fair weather friends largely disappeared. What does he have now? Parasites. New Age crazies. Yes-men. A damn cult of all things.
If he’s hearbroken and lonely now – and it certainly appears so – my heart goes out to him, but if ever a man dug his own grave this is the man.
he’s a destructive human being? Lol, if this is true, why is Jimmy the one always asking so politely when asked about the breakup. If he was so irrate when he got let go the man shows an INCREDIBLE amount of self control when confronted by fans unlike Mr. Billy.
Chris: “I can see from the quote you posted from the article that Jimmy may not have wanted the same studio experience that he’d had in the past, but I don’t see any references to touring.”
I think it’s implied, assuming Jimmy wanted to stay on in SP at all. What else is there to do in a rock band, if not record? It’s that, tour, or sit on ass.
@jjb – lol… No i don’t think Siamese Dream would have completely flopped, but nor do I think it would be half as good as it is, had Jimmy not been a part of creating it. Nor do I think Siamese Dream would have existed in its present form had the band been without Jimmy before it’s inception. You don’t need me to tell you how many times Billy has explained how the direction of the band changed and the kind of music they, he, was able to make when Jimmy came on board. But this is kind of getting a bit tangential and heading off into conjecture land, saying songs like Disarm would have sounded ‘exactly the same’, it’s just unquantifiable.
fuck you billy, you are unhealty and I don’t wanto you to prevent me to reach highest levels of my creativity
lol what a damaged boy..
that’s a very sad read..
I think if more people realized what they needed (or did not need) in their lives, and acted on it, the world would be a happier place. Staying in any sort of relationship just for the sake of staying helps no one, it usually ends up hurting instead. Nobody but BC and JC were actually effected by that decision.
Jimmy didn’t want to “live” in the studio. He was okay with creating music. Billy did nnot gain with Mike as the drummer as I am sure Mike does not live in the studio. Jimmy was okay with making music in the studio. He is currently working on an album.
I have to agree with Billy in this.They “ALL” use to be in a unhealthy state, the pass has a way of doing it to you.Being drug addicted or any kind of abuse down the line.It’s a fact removing unhealthy issues from your life or people that is,you lead more productive life.If you don’t you crash and burn sooner or later.Despite how many albums and music theses two have made together.
Things change and so do people.And people do move in different directions and so have Billy and Jimmy.In my experiences, even tho I’ve seen Jimmy more be the laid back one.It’s really the quiet ones, you got look out for, i’ve learned.
The ones that are straight forward like Billy you know what he’s about.Because he makes no secret, in what he’s about, and how he presents himself to fans etc…Wither Jimmy is in a unhealthy state or not, WHO knows but GOD himself.
I just wish Billy,Jimmy D’arcy and James would stop arguing and sling the mud at each and just comes to some kind of understanding and forgiveness.It gets old all the band drama really .I just like to have some good music not all this “he said” and “she said”, bull and mud sling.Just sad really.
Good points, jjb, Drevpile, et al. Fatalist guy (yours truly) says that there are no perceivable alternate realities, so he’ll not enter conjecture land, either. :-)
“…moving out of your dad’s basement doesn’t mean you get a 50% stake in the family business.” That said, buying 50% of available shares kind of does, and even one voting share gives a voice. This is not to say that Jimmy actually bought into TSP Machine Inc. or Martha’s Music LLC or whatever legal entities make up “The Smashing Pumpkins” in the eyes of the government. (You should see what corps and LLCs make up Pearl Jam these days, which is a good thing for independent bands.) If Jimmy bought half of the re-created Pumpkins, or at holds some stock* in any of the aforementioned entities, then he was (or even still is, if Billy didn’t buy him out) entitled to his opinion RE: the direction of the band.
I think the big issue from the BC/JC incident is Billy’s perception of Jimmy, and whether that borders on some sort of defamation. That’s the one cuts close to (I cringe to write) “Team Jimmy” and possibly Pumpkins fans in general. On a silly note, I hope one of the unleashed “20 years worth of pent-up insults” by Jimmy included: “Well, the Jerk Store called, and they’re running out of you!” ;-P
*I remember reading years ago that Jimmy made a killing in the stock market back in the 1990s, using his AOL account. It seems likely that Jimmy would have been savvy enough to actually own a legal piece of the Smashing Pumpkins, when Billy resurrected the name and invited Jimmy (or however the story goes).
I don’t understand, if jimmy held a stake in the corporate side of smashing pumpkins, which I suspected all along since they got back together, can billy as either equal partner or majority shareholder just fire jimmy like that?
@Drevpile- I totally agree Jimmy made them a far better band than they would have been otherwise. I have no doubt that without him, Billy is less successful…maybe SP ends up on the level of, say, Weezer, or Soul Asylum, or Kula Shaker or something ;)
Maybe Billy is jealous of Jimmy. I mean Jimmy is the one with a wife and children, and he seems to be happy. Whereas Billy seems to be lonely, and desperately searching for something to make him happy. So he moves Jimmy out of the picture because he doesn’t want to be constantly reminded of something he doesn’t have but wants very much. I dont know… i may be putting to much thought into it.
The Smashing Pumpkins are dead, If you think otherwise you’re in denial.
Well, I wasn´t there and since every piece of information that gets to you through the media is like a more or less garbled transmission (I don´t believe that we are provided with accurate accounts of events – there always seems to be somebody´s underlying intention), I´d hate to pass a judgement of any sort. But should this be true, then there is only one thing to say – “When are you finally going to grow up, Mr. Corgan?”
@jjb hahaha – :) Kula Shaker sounds about right!
@gyang333 I guess with all the intricacies involved with SP-as-business entities, assuming that Billy is the majority shareholder and/or Chairman of the Board and/or Chief Executive Officer and/or even bandleader-employee, he could have just fired Jimmy-as-drummer-employee from the band. Jimmy-as-shareholder/LLC-member/business-partner and Jimmy-as-corporate-officer might still hold these titles, and he just has to sit back and watch the download money come in.
Wait, ‘Teargarden’ has been free so far…? Sell ‘em obelisks already! ;-)
If Billy didn’t put his music above all else we would have never heard it in the first place. It’s certainly sad to read these things, but good for you for being pure, Billy. No one else has to understand.
how was jimmy not too damaged and a destructive human being when he was the only one to return with billy corgan and lend credibility to the “revival” as it were? that’s what i want to know
Ask your shaman.
All this talk of SP as an “LLC” or “corporate entity” and Billy and Jimmy as “majority / minority stockholders” is SO depressing.
@Travis, totally. It shatters the idealistic notion of art for its own sake vs. being savvy so that you can create art to pay the bills on time. :-) Speculating the business side actually gives us something more-or-less objective and quantifiable: Ownership percentage vs. who exactly is the ‘heart’ of the band vs. how big of a thunder god JC actually is. ;-)
For what it’s worth, I’d rather have SP (or any band I like) attend to their own music business plan than to trust a major record company to do it for them.
Billy’s attitude and state of mind he presents in this interview really are making me start to question whether I want to pay attention anymore.
This is the first time since I began listening to them almost 20 years ago that I’ve thought this. It’s like I’ve had enough of his psychological self destruction.
I mean, he’s totally two-faced about loving people and then saying crazy, hateful shit about the other band members. I think I’m just going to try listening to the music alone without his commentary for a while and see where that leads me, because now I feel like the pseudo-relationship I have with him as a fan has now become “unhealthy.”
To me the saddest thing is the friendship. From about the time Zwan broke up until now, it really seemed like the two had grown out of just making f’n awesome music together to being really good friends.
Even when Jimmy left, I liked to think that maybe it just did have to do with him wanting to take it easy after being in SP for so long…to watch a 20 year friendship end like this is sad.
This guy was my fucking idol. I feel bad for him, but this is just way too much. Firing Jimmy. Calling himself Shamus Aquarius or whatever and belonging to some crazy hippy cult. His delusion is virtually unparalleled.
It will be interesting to see the next podcast, as there is absolutely no way to spin this positively.
Could anynone please help me out? Since I´m not a native speaker, I´m not sure what is the meaning behind the white van utterance. I´m fairly certain what Jim Morrison hinted at by the blue bus expression in The End lyrics, but I can´t figure this one out :-). Is it a metaphorical or rather an idiomatic expression? Could anyone be so kind as to clarify it to me? I´d really appreciate that.
@Marek I took it to mean “big time” music tours vs. “small time” music tours. A popular band would have tour buses and chartered/private planes to do a world tour of arenas and stadiums. A modest/starting band would play dive bars and small clubs whenever they can, cramming their equipment and all band members in one vehicle, which is usually a white-colored van. :-)
I’m guessing it means “ride around in your shitty van with your tiny band noone cares about, whilst I stay rich and popular and successful and play in the big league”. It’s bullshit and it’s ugly.
@tom Ugly indeed, coming off the back of his love and forgiveness cult spiel > inferring ‘you’ll be nothing without me’ is both beyond lame and in the context of the rest of the interview, really rather sad.
Ahaha, I misinterpreted that when I first read it. I thought that Jimmy was telling Billy to just ride around in his white van. Which I took to be a reference to the Today video and that he’s just cruising on the success of that. Which I found to be particularly funny. Oh well… :(
seriously, people just change…if you don’t know that then your young or you won’t grow up, it’s a part of life.
everything you see in the article, the drum clinics, it’s just scratching the surface i’m sure anyway
I have to say,I agree with lot here,if bily is in a supposedly LOVING place..I would say this is NOT in tune with”Body-Mind-Soul-Integration”…
I hate to really judge anyone either way in this.But it seems drama is always following him and he’s his own worse enemy..
I guess, I be one to say like any other fan ,really hatin the drama, in this…
Billy has shut out any opinions from fan’s.I get he doesn’t want the negative vibes etc..But he doesn’t even want honest or constructive opinions.Just people who*KISS HIS BUTT ROYALLY”That’s fine.But your not going to get honesty in that.
Most of us want good music and that is it…
Myself like the NEW spiritual Billy Corgan, because I’m a spiritual person myself.But all the dictatorship and keeping the fan from expressing themselves,Billy made a huge mistake in that also.And this mud sling at SP members and or Billy is for “THE BIRDS”
WHERE IS THE LOVE?????????
Can someone explain to me why Billy corgan is so fat now? I thought he was supposed to be eating pure and healthy now yet somehow this guy got to be obese as shit.
What’s the haps here?
Consult the obelisk.
All, maybe the Obelisk will guide you to the true answer. Thats why Billy is packaging them with the EPs.
I’m not opening mine man, it’s an investment
Billy needs to just get a reality tv show and pack it in. For the most part, nobody gives a shit except for the hardcore fans, and he seems absolutely hell bent on making it nearly impossible to enjoy the music in the midst of his 24-7 pity party he’s been throwing for himself after the commercial success of Mellon Collie. And why is it these days, I rarely hear Corgan talking about actual music? Keep in mind that bitching about record sales and financial success does not count. Newsflash dude, you’re a fucking musician. Your job is to make music. Your job is to listen to music. Your job is to talk about music. Either get better PR, commit to being tabloid fodder, or shut up and make interesting music that the kids will give a shit about in 2010. It’s not 1996 anymore and you’re killing the only people who actually care anymore.
I mean, since only about twelve of these will probably be sold it’s gotta be worth something later once billys creativity grows to it’s heights without Jimmy there to keep holding him back
While I can’t abide the tone, Goat, I agree that Billy should talk more about art and less about commerce.
I’m not putting them in the same league, but if you read the letters of people like Chopin or Beethoven, it’s shocking how incessantly they bitched about not getting paid their due.
lol @Floppy
THAT WAS FUNNY….
to Ryan and Tom: Thank you very much. This interpration really makes sense.
to Tree_Spirit: I agree completely. Preventing fans from expressing their opinions on the official website somewhat shocked me. It´s not right. It´s not democratic. And there´s certainly no “love and light” in such an act, and I doubt that he reads through the comments on this blog or anywhere else. But what was the main reason for taking a drastic measure like that? Is he afraid to face possible disapproval? Maybe he just doesn´t really care what we have to say. Sure, there are a lot of people out there who can´t do better than whine and swear, but there are also people who are interested in an intelligent and cultivated discussion, because SP is still relevant to them. That´s why I like to visit hipstersunited by the way :).
Marek: Art ain’t democratic! It requires a different set of values!
Johnny Goat: “And why is it these days, I rarely hear Corgan talking about actual music?”
Billy talks about music all the time (to see this, just page through the HU archives). We cover those music-oriented interviews and conversations, but they don’t get picked up very widely at all.
It’s almost impossible not to believe Billy creates a lot of this drama for the purpose of getting his all-important music heard. Remember what he thinks of the current atmosphere for musicians:
Billy’s always been a guy who plays ball, rather than taking his and going home. If this is what he thinks the rules of the game are these days, I’d expect him largely to abide by them. Going to/believing in/talking openly about the shaman, etc., would be one way to go about it…
Sounding bitter, twisted and somewhat delusional is one way to kick off an ‘aggressive marketing campaign’.
Who’s the destructive one? BC is nuts if he thinks he can go it alone. These new songs are just not too good without Jimmy and top notch production. It’s a shame. They could be really good. Sounds like he could have had another MCIS with all his ambition. But without Jimmy and a surrounding cast that has somewhat of a voice, forget it. He’s going to be more obscure than ever with this approach and attitude, which will only fuel his attitude even further.
I definitely don’t want to overemphasize this ‘Billy is playing us’ angle. He’s real-er than not, but I think he seizes on his natural tendencies or ‘real’ inclinations, amplifies or enlarges them, burnishes them, presents them. That’s what artists do for a living, eh.
While that may be, the fact that he is either completely crazy or just completely lying to us, or is half crazy and half deceiving… it seems like it hardly matters anymore.
I just don’t quite get the “white van” part. Is that, like, the “ice cream truck” from that song or something?
Jimmy has always been a big part of this band for me. Its why I tend to like listenign to MSOTS over Adore [dodges objects being hurled]. But I don’t hate Adore, live the material was awesome. With 3 precussionists they filled the gap.
All that being said, I’m extremely more optimistic about the new music than I was about Adore, not only based on what we have heard, but also because of the fact that Billy is still using a real drummer. This is BIG. It helps me realize, deep down inside, that it was probably more the lack of real drumming that faults Adore, not the fact that there’s no Jimmy. Adore and TFE just seem soooooo drab and undynamic, thanks to the repetitive articificial drumming.
If the song-writign is strong, I’ll still be able to move forward with Billy. And So far I really like 2 our ot 4 of the Teargarden tracks A LOT. Afterall, many fans hail the 1996 MCIS tour as “the best tour”…and that was without Jimmy. Proving the musical content is more important than the musicians.
Listen, everyone knows I love JC and he is my favortie drummer of all time. But thats due in part to the amazing songs he would be playing on. Good musicians are easier to come by than good song-writers.
Are you guys delusional? Thank God other people are noticing what’s going on. I have been a huge fan since Zwan’s Mary Star of the Sea came out, and that was the best music Billy and Jimmy have done since MCIS. They *sounded* happy.
Then Billy breaks up the band. SP starts up again in 07, cool. Zeitgeist was 3 stars. They honestly didn’t have a producer to guide them. American Gothic was cool.
But when you watch If All Goes wrong, there’s a bit of promise with the new songs, although the playing was timid (compared to Zwan).
The Chris Isaak show basically showed us it really is a solo Billy Corgan show. SP is not SP without Jimmy.
Recently, Billy has said that Ginger and Jeff are essentially hired hands, and that the only real other member is Mike, with Billy doing all the work. Does that honestly sound attractive to you peoples? I’ll still dl the Teargarden sessions, but I can gaurantee it won’t be anywhere near Mary Star of the Sea.
@Marek Dunovsky
I totally agree…
There is no love when there is no opinions and views.Taking the fan voice away is not right thing to do here and banning everyone that doesn’t agree is not either.I thought listening to people was the key to LOVE?never figure that out where Bily’s thought was in that one..lol
I have always been a very supporting fan myself, and I still support the music and love theory, but the control from Billy is stealing everything that is special and intimate between SP and their fans.I DO NOT support the controlling of others.It’s gone bad when they took people’s voices away from them on SP.com.I understand lot do whine and swear a lot it gets annoying.
I’ll always really <3 Billy.But ,I stay away from the drama of SP and or Billy and try to stay positive where there is none.
I think the need is to start focusing on,"MUSIC",not the drama of "he said and she said.I guess that what sells albums?I thought music sold on it own worth to fan's.Go figure!
jjb: This is the problem with Corgan. Yes, the “mainstream” music press isn’t interested in “music talk” and is only interested in Jessica Simpson, and marketing gimmicks. No shit, it’s a completely outdated, expensive, and flawed mode of media. HOWEVER, instead of giving it the big finger because it truly is SHITTY, he constantly panders to it and therefore REINFORCES it’s existence. Take Rolling Stone for example, there is really NO reason for this magazine to exist in 2010. And yet it DOES because of oldie-goldies like Corgan who will give VH1 Behind the Music-type blurbs and interviews in a desperate attempt to attain Radiohead-level success in a world where Radiohead wouldn’t have “Radiohead-level success” if not for the fact that they somehow fit well within this outdated media-source while coincidentally making popular and sonically challenging music.
I mean, this guy is a fucking millionaire and has legions of devoted fans who worship him, and yet he has the guff to complain about both his fans, his bandmates, and the very industry which GAVE him his success. It’s ridiculous and completely TAINTS the act of listening to his music. I mean, I used to worship this guy and now I think he’s a total dick. He really just needs to keep his mouth shut, and LAY LOW, and just focus on his core audience. Forget Rolling Stone. Forget Spin. Forget FUCKING RADIO!!! This whole “free album thing” is just bullshit. You were selling albums before, maybe the industry has just evolved to a level where a musician SHOULDN’T attain such a massive level of financial and critical success. He should just be content with his fanbase and stop participating in this bullshit outdated mode of music-marketing.
I don’t think people give enough credit to the fact that if you make a good song, people will hear about it online, and share it. You don’t have to have some huge advertising campaign. It’s 2010, there are a shitload of music blogs and indie bands that self-perpetuate themselves without any gimmicks and attention getting moves simply because they are MAKING MUSIC THAT IS FRESH AND CONTEMPORARY. It’s like he’s trying to co-op the facade of “going viral” and “youth oriented” modes of music consumption when, at the heart, he’s still just a dude from the 90′s trying to get on the cover of Rolling Stone.
It’s just sad and backwards.
Sorry, that was a total cliche SP-Fan rant.
The funniest thing about all of this is that Billy is being as self destructive now as he was when he was surrounded by drug addicts and trippin’ on LSD and doing X.
The only difference is that the art is suffering.
Think of the art Billy!
Let’s face it… he’s never again going to surround himself with anything other than a bunch of “Yes Men” because he’s too much of a pussy to deal with people who have contrary beliefs than his own.
He’s become the epitome of what is wrong with this world, where extremists surround themselves with like-minded idealists, and then ignore the reality they live in as every circle jerks to their own baseless ideals.
It’s just sick. Sicker than any drug addiction, and Jimmy fucking kicked that shit and has moved on to be a caring father and even more of a brilliant drummer than back in the heroin daze.
I think it’s too late for Billy though. He’s too old and too lost to ever find his way out of this madness… it’s just a shame it’s the kind of madness that produces mediocre art and endless social drama.
I haven’t read the whole article cause I can’t find any store that has it yet, but from what I have seen this verifies everything I was starting to think. It is sad and is probably the final nail in my youthful naivete’. Billy is/has always been an extremely self absorbed person, albeit an extremely creative one as is often the case…. I don’t pretend to know any of them personally but Jimmy is more grounded now and probably started questioning all this weird shit Billy has been espousing for a few years….. it’s all bullshit. We have seen the real Billy(the one I grew up idolizing) recently in interviews spewing the venom at the deserving people(record labels, etc.) and then you see this. It is hard to believe this is anything other than a publicity to stunt to promote the worst(in my opinion) and only truly bad music he has ever released. The fact that I care enough to type this feeds directly in to what Billy loves….. attention.
I think what it comes down to is that Billy has to have ‘Yes’ men around him. He doesn’t have a voice to tell him when something sucks. If they disagree with him they are unhealthy and out of the picture!
He definitely doesn’t have a filter now… only “Yes” men and the new stuff should never be released under the Smashing Pumpkins name.
lulz… glad I’m not the only who sees this.
I really can’t fathom how anyone can sit here and honestly defend Billy. Billy didn’t part with Jimmy on amicable or even respectable terms. He called him “destructive”, “unhealthy”, and then told him to go ride around in a white van. Jimmy was good enough up until 2008 for Billy, following him with zwan and the sp reunion. Billy continuously talks shit about everyone from his past, whereas they have chosen to move on peacefully. I really believe that this cult has had a lot to do with his current mind-frame. What kind of people discard those that care about them when they suddenly decide that they longer serve their purpose? I hate how after so many years (and his confessions and now “spiritual memoir”) later he is still trying to garner sympathy and playing the victim, while he continuously shits on everyone that ever cared about him. Too much scapegoating going on with Billy, nothing ever seems to be his fault, it’s always someone else who wronged him. God forbid anyone ever tell him that he’s full of shit. I know Billy has never, or even allowed himself, to have a true family, and I don’t think he truly understands what love is, which why it is so easy for these cults to take over his thinking and life, but I can’t make any excuses for him anymore. Enough is enough. Such a pity, he was such a tremendously talented individual and he has shown himself to be so ugly, a self-absorbed megalomaniac. But I doubt that he would care what anyone else thinks, he has got his hippy cult to keep him warm at night. Also, I don’t buy the “billy is just playing us” angle one bit. It’s just another excuse for his poor behaviour and actions towards others.
I’m so glad HU is back…:)
Oh yeah, this is a great website. The mobile site is very sexy too :)
man. quite impressed with the comments on this one.. i don’t even need to say anything. Nice to see more than one side being argued here at Hipsters United.
I’ve got a big feeling that this is going to be the nail in the coffin for a LOT of that fans that are left and still giving a shit. It’s too bad it’s come to this, but Billy should not be surprised at this point if he finds himself playing smaller venues and riding in white vans.
Speaking of nails and coffins… I’ve just put my small but respectable smashing pumpkins memorabilia collection up for sale : http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=160410507561
A couple of things.
1) where does everyone get the idea that Billy surrounds himself with yes-men? The only feedback we know that anyone gives Billy is public feedback on Twitter, which I would expect to be positive. Nobody is going to tweet “this new song that @Billy wrote is atrocious”. There isn’t any evidence that Billy fired Jimmy because Jimmy disagreed with him. It may be the case, but I don’t think there’s anything in this interview that would lead anyone to reasonably draw that conclusion. For all we know, Kerry Brown could provide a lot of constructive feedback, we just don’t know.
2) Anyone who thinks that somehow Jimmy left because of Billy’s new-age beliefs needs to go rewatch If All Goes Wrong. Jimmy talks about Asheville “vibrating at a special frequency” or something like that. Again, maybe he couldn’t get as far into it as Billy and got fed up, but there is zero evidence that’s the case.
i also don’t believe billy fired jimmy. it just seems too far fetched.
@devi ever good luck getting rid of that stuff.. with the vibes going around the fan base right now i don’t think anyone is wanting to spend another dime on anything related to SP.
and just to clarify, i believe they had a big blowout, jimmy said fuck this and left. billy, rather than admitting he was abandoned, now sees it as him having fired jimmy.
and how are we supposed to believe billy? he’s a proven liar. he’s now implying that back in 2000 jimmy was still using drugs (jimmy you go to rehab james gtfo), but back then he was saying jimmy was clean and sober. so what’s the true story here? i can’t trust anything he says anymore.
@ Adam … As long as I cover shipping costs, I’m fine. Funny, because I kinda feel the same way as Billy and I definitely need as positive energy as I can get in my recording studio, and Pumpkins stuff just ain’t doing it for me anymore. Can’t wait to hear more from JCC though! Just brilliant work that man and his bass playin’ friend. Even lyrically… great things coming Jimmy’s way for sure. Anyhow, I’m sure one of the “religious” Pumpkins’ fans will cum all over the chance at getting some old-era pumpkin memorabilia. I’m over it though… there’s too many great artists out there with true tenacity, passion, and unforgiving spirit of creativity I’d rather spend my time, energy, and money on. The Pumpkins had a place once in my life, but the echo has faded and I’m ready to move on.
This was posted on netphoria by charmbag.
“Billy’s behavior over the past couple years has been not unlike the downward spiral of a drug addict. this interview is like the part where he pawns his mother’s wedding ring for $50 worth of coke. stooping so low for five minutes of payoff.
BC is completely approval-oriented. he’s willing to sell any narrative that he believes will earn him approval and respect, and he’s represented himself in so many disparate ways that his words have lost all meaning. one minute he’s the anti-sellout, all about “the common man”, the ordinary fan, connecting with the suburban malaise. when that idea no longer serves him, because it either violates the beliefs he holds onto in order to deal with the reality of his diminished status, or because it no longer is getting him attention, he moves on. then he gives the middle finger to the vulgar and ignorant commoners who don’t understand his god-given talent. he sells a song to Visa to make a pathetically transparent statement about how money doesn’t matter. he’s stadium rock and then he’s self-involved jam band. he’s a rock star and then he’s a serious, introspective poet. he has no values, no core, and he’ll sacrifice everyone around him in an attempt to build himself up.
his entire identity is tied to what other people think of him, which obviously worked at least functionally well when his albums were going platinum. but now he’s having to live in a world where not only do his albums not sell very well, but the mythology of rock no longer has much relevance in American culture. BC’s whole paradigm was centered around the idea that rock ‘n’ roll “mattered”, and how he knew it mattered was that millions of people said so. now that that’s fallen apart, he’s willing to listen to any bullshit artist who can come up with some justification for what he perceives to be a mistake. Billy never talked about god until religion could be used to give him a position of superiority over others. he now feels that god has given him a favored, prophet-like role as an artist, and it seems plain that somehow this is supposed to make up for the loss of such a role in the eyes of the public. it’s not surprising that he went with this New Age Christianity, not traditional Christianity, nor Buddhism, nor Islam or any other such religion, because a strict adherence to any of those religions would offer no opportunity to give himself special worldly importance. they all teach of the humility and equality of man. (more or less)
when Billy made good music, it was when he could tap into the desperation and destruction of these feelings of inadequacy. he actually wallowed in them, and seemingly accepted them as an identifying feature of who he was. he rejects all of that now, probably because it was draining to live that way, but he’ll never make the kind of music he used to, despite his skill. he’s totally out of touch with himself now and the songs are all shit because of it. they’re flat, emotionless and dishonest. I feel sorry for Billy, and I pity anyone who tries to convince themselves that they enjoy his music.”
take to that what y’all will.
I guess I’ll throw in my two cents to Chris’ two good points. :-)
1. It seems that while Billy tweets his truisms, he rarely interacts with any @-replies. To a degree, “about ____ ago via txt” implies this, since many people use apps or the main Twitter web interface to tweet, @-reply, and direct message. Tweeting via texting is usually limiting. And I’m sure that there are some mean people who would @-reply to Billy with harsh comments.
2. New Age beliefs aren’t monolithic, so there could be a contradiction there. I’ll definitely re-watch the DVD, but Jimmy’s ‘vibrations’ could be the general musician/rock and roll concept of good vibes versus doctrine from a religious group.
I’ve been watching this thread periodically today, and it’s been a great conversation so far! Thanks, Hipsters United!
for all those that don’t have the magazine aside from the scan there is a blurb in the editors section (page 8) that says billy corgan got in touch with THEM earlier this year and “said he wanted to tell the story of his lost decade”
interesting that not only did corgan go looking for the article but he went looking to talk about his past and not the future/teargarden specifically.
i guess i should have added that i am saying this (^^^that^^^) because i hadn’t seen anyone mentioning it and also i can’t remember if it was here or some other fan resource (long day) but i noticed some people trying to make it out that billy corgan was railroaded by the interviewer into talking about his past or something and not the music.
so basically billy knew what would get him the attention he wants (ie talking more smack about james and jimmy).
hope it helps sell some of those obelisks!!
yeah lol @ the obelisk being in the giant main article picture like a pepsi can in the background of an episode of seinfeld or something
plz respect the words of Courtney Love:
“Billy’s being a douche, but he’ll stop,” Love says through mouthfuls of cupcake. “It’s like clockwork.”
k thanx.
You can’t lie when your eating a cupcake. It makes you happy and content, and happy content people dont lie :)
Wasn’t Billy being kind of douchey (or awesomely funny/crazy, depending on how I look at it) this time last year?
Maybe spring messes with him. Vibrationally.
his new years resolution is to lose an increasing percentage of his remaining fans every year.
@jjb, Maybe lol Quite honestly there is a lot of different point of views here as to what this may be. So here is my take: Billy is at an extremely confusing stage of his life. Older, aloner, less album sales and way less supporters, many many more detractors to his music. There are times when we all feel lied to, threatened or like something in our life isn’t going with our “flow.” There are also times when we realize friends or supporters arent all they’re cracked up to be. If he kicked Jimmy out, it is because he felt that the decision had to be done. Jimmy responding the way he did because obviously felt betrayed and fed up. 20 years of service to a man, an entire CAREER just tossed into the wind.
I don’t know why Billy is outting all his former friends like this. First they leave the band, or quit under mysterious circumstances usually “it was just time to go” later on we come to find Billy going off about drugs, sex, bad attitudes, unseen negativity etc! What is he doing, if these people are out of the frame they’re not important to the current pumpkin world which quite honestly is in utter despair right now. Partially because of Billy’s antics, partially because the world has always viewed Billy as an egomaniac, self-serving pretentious old fool! Even when he was young! These things and the way he says them does not help. They are said in truth and honesty but they’re said at a time when we as fans need reassurance that we’re not following a man who is what the media portrays him to be.
The god damn music is good, very very good. No one can deny his talent. Its just too bad the man behind it is coming off as some kind of hypocrite, everything hes been called in the comments here basically.
I will deny his talent. He was only ever been as good as the producers and musicians he worked with. By himself, he is mediocre at best.
of course you’ll deny his talent because it makes things easier for you. no matter what he says its laughable to think that producers alone made his music so good or the lack of contributions from the likes of James or D’arcy.
I won’t defend what he has said but it has no connection whatsoever to the music he is currently making. I think the new stuff is great and that is all that matters to me. If all the negative energy he dispenses somehow makes the music suffer than that is one thing but it appears to be having the opposite effect.
Do I believe I deserve to be in a discussion about how mediocre Billy Corgan’s talent is surrounded by his current cult of “Yes Men”?
Yes man, I do.
Seriously though… to each their own. I’m audi 1979… laterz suckaz
Despite all of this, I think A Stitch in Time is really an incredible song; whatever billy’s attitude or circumstances, the fact that he can still write at this level never ceases to amaze me.
Thanks for the info about Billy requesting the interview Floppy. Figures.
Yes Billy can still write good music. That is his talent. When he was around James & Jimmy he was creating great music. There is no dispute to this.
Those who say he is mediocre will never understand what it means to write a good authentic song .. it needs a mountain of talent – Billy writes AMAZING songs so you can imagine how incredibly talented he is!
The song is not – musicians and producers .. it needs only voice and guitar – that’s the soul of the song! Everything else is a bonus.
True, a song can be composed with only a voice or guitar (or just one of those, for that matter), but the other members of a band have an undeniable influence on the songwriting because of the extent to which they define the songwriter’s life at the time. And I’m not talking about co-writing credits; frequently this occurs in subconscious ways. But it’s foolish to say that Iha and D’arcy didn’t influence the songs Billy was writing in at least some significant fashion, given how much time they all spent together back then.
The real question is whether their influence affected the music’s quality in a significant way, and I don’t believe it did. I really don’t think Corgan has diminished as a songwriter whatsoever; Death From Above, Bleeding the Orchid, A Stitch in Time, Tilt (despite its criminally sub-B-side status), Gossamer, and other songs are as good or better than anything he’s ever written. I know a *lot* of people vehemently disagree with this, but Corgan is and always was the Smashing Pumpkins to me. Iha’s songs are embarrassingly-bad, in my opinion.
I knew something was up when I heard Billy talking about the ‘genius’ of Sky Saxon. Dude was nothing more than a mumbling hippie leech for the last 40 years. Whatever ‘genuis’ he had in him was long, long gone. That Billy was tied up in a cult with Saxon explains a lot.
For fans of Billy, this is the Exodus. To mix metaphors, we’ve got a long, long wait until he records his own ‘Time Out of Mind’.
A Stitch in Time, Tom Tom, The Fellowship, West Coast, Freak, As Rome Burns, Owata, Song for a Son, Rose March, Sunkissed, 99 Floors, Peace and Love, No Surrender, Gossamer, Stellar
@D4 — Interesting point, re: Time Out of Mind. And it’s hard to disagree with you about the cult involvement. Though I think the group Sky Saxon was affiliated with are genuinely sweet, well-intentioned people… still a cult. Hard to reconcile for me, especially when Sky’s wife Sabrina has been a total sweetheart in correspondences with me.
Still haven’t seen someone mention a new song that stands up to Machina.
Ah, D4, it’s a pleasure to hear your voice of reason again.
@jillysp
Perhaps Sky’s wife is a sweetheart but we don’t know much about the rest of them. Father Yod seemed like a complete nutjob, a pedophile and drug addict. Anyway, Sabrina is not part of the cult. She is a Christian Orthodox.
Oh you guys..don’t you know you’re playing right into Billy’s master plan. This was calculated, part of the journey. muwahaha
jk
James had some good songs. Aeroplane Box Set had some awsome James songs. It brought a contrast.
Did anyone else hear that?
It was the sound of the final nail going into the coffin.
the final nail in the coffin was when jimmy left, this was just billy wrenching it out to try and drive it in a little straighter and deeper.
@Floppy Nono
Yes and no, maybe I was in denial about it all. But as much as I would like to buy into jjb’s positive spin… I can’t do it anymore. I have been a patient fan but this is too much.
I don’t want to link to another site, because I am not sure if you can here. However, you should see how Corgan is getting HAMMERED by the commenters on HuffPo.
I wish that SP 2.0 would have just played the hits and integrated some new stuff as they went. I think everything would be different now because they would have been embraced by soo many more fans. I will never forget how excited I was when I read that Billy said during a TFE performance: “I want my old songs back” or something of that nature. I was so excited.
@deadfchild i don’t think they were to care if you linked but i am also not sure. i was reading the blabbermouth posts on him and they were all the usual FUCK YOU UNCLE FESTER GO DIE.
i agree that there was a better way to handle this reunion and setlists and even billy corgan knows that but of course billy corgan doesn’t operate that way. ;)
oh yeah, for all those interested someone on my twitter list got a msg today that their teargarden WILL NOT BE SHIPPED UNTIL MAY OR JUNE SO WAY TO GO WITH THOSE RELEASE DATES AND KEEPING ON SCHEDULE!!!
as a consolation prize to the other 11 of you who bought this without thinking how long it takes a hippie to carve little 2 inch phallic shapes i will be providing you this video. please accept my condolences
You can link wherever you’d like (except to PDF scans of this article), just include a hyperlink in your comment and it should automatically get linked when you post it.
Billy Corgan Loves Jessica Simpson, Has High Self Regard:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/03/05/billy-corgan-loves-jessic_n_487447.html
The comments are pure gold.
@deafchild
Pure gold? Let’s take a sampling.
“Here’s a clue for you Billy: No one cares about your stupid washed up band or your crappy music.”
“I’m sory but he’s creepy looking! White men just don’t look good bald!!!!!”
“He’s sooo into himself. Major do rk”
studiodog
Pumpkins TBK EP release delayed. They made the obelisk 2 feet tall not 2 inches. IT WILL NOT FIT IN BOX! I will blog details this weekend.
i am praying to raptor jesus tonight for this to be real
Spinal Tap’d
did you guys know the stonehenge thing is based on something that actually happened to black sabbath? now you do!
Deafchild,
Never have I seen a pettier clique of shadenfreude-wallowing midgets than the loyal posters at the Huffington Post. Ignore them or become one of them.
HuffPo comments are a pretty accurate representation of what the general public thinks about BC these days, outside of Pumpkins fandom.
I just laughed for a solid minute at Static Cat. Thanks, Floppy.
no problem bro!
I’m amazed that no one in these comments has even touched on the most important issue that Billy’s interview raises: The safety of Jimmy Chamberlin’s Children. I feel immense pity for these two young kids who are going to be brought up by a parent with such a destructive personality. I hope that Jimmy can get his life turned around, but that doesn’t seem likely at this point. I just pray that the child welfare services where Jimmy lives will step in before it’s too late.
I guess I should have read the whole article before posting but… being an Asheville resident, I agree with Jimmy.. it is different here(vibrations if you will) but Billy is on a whole different kick…. he makes some good points about the poisoning of people thru processed food… so maybe I agree with him more than I originally thought. My thing is the music… It is definitely not up to par. I believe he can still write great stuff…. look at some of the residency songs. Were they just dropped? or is the “cult” influencing him to release this “new” music.
@Russel
Since when do we believe everything that Billy says?
How is the Metro DVD?
What a bunch of low-lifes. If the man is so horrible, get the fuck out here and find something else to do.
A total shame.
What right do you people think you have to pretend you know what Billy should think, do or say!?
what right do you think you have to pretend to know what right we have to pretend to know about how billy should think, do or say!?
I don’t. But I choose to devote my time to people, personalities and artists I like and with the aspects of their realization I agree with.
By the way Floppy, don’t feel too concerned or aimed by what I say, I know you’re just here to joke and ridicule the situation and the people around.
what in the world gave you that idea?
I’m wrong?
You just seem to be kidding because you put too much emotion into it(I thought, voluntarily), using caps, ridiculizing, etc…
i meant the idea that i might feel concerned by what you say
Right.
Maybe your “we” in “what right do you think you have to pretend to know what right we have to pretend to know about how billy should think, do or say!?”.
Any chance to feel morally superior, right guys?
I hate Smashing Pumpkins anti-fans.
So with you here enmity.
In light of this ‘tabloid’ interview, maybe the notion of BC’s Jessica association being possibly ‘self-sabotaging’ might have gained a little more traction.
[...] Chamberlin last March, as well as Corgan’s perceptions of Chamberlin’s character. Hipsters United has been covering this sections of this article, often with intense fan comments, depending on the [...]
[...] the recently much discussed March 18th Rolling Stone article, writer Brian Hiatt gave us a little tease of the latest incarnation of the Smashing Pumpkins [...]
Jimmy’s going to come back. When he got fired the first time, they hired a drummer named Matt, but billy needed Jimmy so he drove Matt away. Well now hes got a drummer named Mike!! Both of their names start with the letter M!!! Jimmy’s coming back!!!
[...] Chamberlin last March, as well as Corgan’s perceptions of Chamberlin’s character. Hipsters United has been covering this sections of this article, often with intense fan comments, depending on the [...]
Fans are idiots, and I say that as a professional musician.
corgan just isn’t comfortable working with other people nor is he comfortable releasing his work to the public as a solo artist. I think he’s still heartbroken that D’arcy and James didn’t want to put up with him anymore. It made him a bitter person.